Daughter has decided to study to be a software engineer.

[bimble]

Nothing useful to say really but, my boyfriend type person, never went to university at all, definitely adhd (to the point where he can't cope with most things other people find easy), and he is paid obscene money in his software engineering job.
Occasionally tries to explain to me what he's doing and, to the extent i can understand anything it it really is interesting, extremely abstract, very maths, but interesting.
Hope she enjoys it, more women are desperately needed in that world.

 

[Anju]

Thanks everyone. Some really helpful replies. Will be going through this thread with the daughter this evening.

 

[two sheds]

Careful not to overwhelm her or she may take up plumbing after all

 

[izz]

Psychology would be an excellent foundation for going into UX (although that's a bit oversubscribed, thanks General Assembly).

I was going to say that but got The Fear

 

[existentialist]

I wonder how much software will be automated by AI in the future? And what does that mean a new programmer should concentrate on?

That question was being asked in the middle years of my IT career, 30 years ago. And we're still not there

 

[two sheds]

That question was being asked in the middle years of my IT career, 30 years ago. And we're still not there

It does happen though - I used to do some translation work but Google translate (assuming that uses IT) is starting to make that redundant. Certainly much much easier than it used to be, largely just needs a final edit to make it respectable.

And I'll bet that IT setups are much easier than they used to be 30 years ago.

 

[equationgirl]

the apis written in any particular language, or several depending on the application?

I would look at python, maybe C++ and java.

 

[Argonia]

A noble ambition

 

[Sprocket.]

I spent my last ten years installing and repairing robots. Mrs S. spent her last six years writing code for applications.
Mrs S. earned a much bigger salary than I could attain.
Hopefully your daughter finds a good niche that she really enjoys and gets well remunerated for.

 

[Shippou-Sensei]

I got a computing degree in the mid 2000s and found it hard to break into industry. Most jobs ask for a few years of experience.
Admitadly I am not great at selling myself and did not have any specialisations.
I ended up doing web service development for a small teaching place before transitioning into teaching.

Nowadays I think one of the ways to break in is to work on open source projects while your learning.

 

[scifisam]

It does happen though - I used to do some translation work but Google translate (assuming that uses IT) is starting to make that redundant. Certainly much much easier than it used to be, largely just needs a final edit to make it respectable.

I've got translation work - despite having no official qualifications - because there's still a fair amount of that work going round. Google translate really isn't close enough to a really translation, and it's unlikely it ever will be - there are just too many synonyms that require choosing the one that actually fits.

Even though maybe 90% of websites and companies rely on it, the number of actual companies communicating internationally has increased in huge numbers, so it's 10% of a far larger pool of clients than there once was.

 

[two sheds]

Ah ok - although I've edited Google translate and found it easy to tidy up into good text. Much much faster than starting from scratch.

 

[girasol]

I also got into Software Engineering when I was 23, back in 1994, but I went down the degree road. In my 15 years working in the industry thereafter the vast majority of people I worked with had computer science degrees. Some had Maths and one had a Philosophy degree. Don't think I met anyone who didn't but maybe times have changed? It takes time to become a good programmer though, so what I'm saying is that you can't be a good programmer in a year or even two. There are a lot of programming principles that should be followed and when they're not the end result is bad, bug filled software.

Edit: I'm a woman, by the way and I ended up working for one of the larger software companies (through 2 takeovers) in the world which shall remain nameless.

 

[Sue]

I work in a Fintech start up. Most people in Engineering have CS degrees but there's a reasonably minority who've studied/worked at something else and then moved into development.

Bootcamps (like Change Your Life - Become a Software Developer at Makers) seem to be a good way in, mainly because of the contacts people make. But they can be quite pricey.

If she's planning on learning herself, getting involved in open source projects is a good way of showing what she can do to potential employers. But they will still expect her to understand the basics/solve coding challenges at interview.

Eta But before she even thinks about bootcamps etc, she should definitely try some self study just to see if she likes it/has the right mindset for it.

 

[scifisam]

Ah ok - although I've edited Google translate and found it easy to tidy up into good text. Much much faster than starting from scratch.

Same - but that just saves the translator a bit of time, really. It doesn't replace them.

It's like how you should really never hire a translator (or transcriber, or editor) who isn't a native speaker in the language they're presenting to the client. They miss out lots of things that a skilled native speaker will pick up on, and they're particularly bad when it comes to dialects and errors or idiomatic language in the source material. Google translate will never even be as good that because it will always be trying to catch up.

In subtitling there's ASR - automatic speech recognition - for some programmes, but it definitely isn't anywhere close to what a human subtitler can provide. Some of the garblings are amusing, some are misleading, some strong accents are rendered completely as garbage, and all of them distract you from the programme.

 

[two sheds]

Same - but that just saves the translator a bit of time, really. It doesn't replace them.

It's like how you should really never hire a translator (or transcriber, or editor) who isn't a native speaker in the language they're presenting to the client. They miss out lots of things that a skilled native speaker will pick up on, and they're particularly bad when it comes to dialects and errors or idiomatic language in the source material. Google translate will never even be as good that because it will always be trying to catch up.

In subtitling there's ASR - automatic speech recognition - for some programmes, but it definitely isn't anywhere close to what a human subtitler can provide. Some of the garblings are amusing, some are misleading, some strong accents are rendered completely as garbage, and all of them distract you from the programme.

Also I was only doing technical-type translations so there are fewer dialect/idiom problems.

 

[AnnO'Neemus]

Whereabouts in the country is she based?

 

[cybershot]

Good for her. Go for it.

programming has the advantage it can usually be done from anywhere but there is one ‘bad’ thing she needs to know about and be prepared for.

bullying and harassment.

it’s a cock heavy industry after all, and yes I know it’s 2021 and no one on urban would dream of such things but the reality it is. It still happens.

our own internal staff survey recently deep dived into such questions and once colour and gender were added to the filter it was pretty damning and shocking that so many people felt they had been bullied or harassed and that the majority of those were non white and or female.

there may be an element of snowflake or war on woke about it but at the end of the day we all have different levels we tolerate. The obvious answer is treat others how you expect to be treated and know the line between what is really banter and what isn’t.

it’s a sad fact but I hope she’s one that’s willing to speak up when necessary and fight the good fight too.

 

[UnderOpenSky]

Hi, our eldest daughter, recently turned 23, has decided to start studying to become a software engineer. Currently doing a free online course to see if she enjoys it.

I've looked online and there are quite a few companies offering training, some arrange a work placement on completion. Just a bit sceptical about whether it's possible to go from zero experience and knowledge to employable in a relatively short time.

Any thoughts or information would be greatly appreciated.

I've no experience of this, but am studying for much more mundane certs in IT support.

What I have found and would caution is there are a lot of companies who will try and charge you a lot of money for training materials you can find for free or for low cost online combined with a certification that you could book yourself for a fraction of the cost.

 

[Anju]

Whereabouts in the country is she based?

Hi, she's in SE London.

 

[Anju]

Good for her. Go for it.

programming has the advantage it can usually be done from anywhere but there is one ‘bad’ thing she needs to know about and be prepared for.

bullying and harassment.

it’s a cock heavy industry after all, and yes I know it’s 2021 and no one on urban would dream of such things but the reality it is. It still happens.

our own internal staff survey recently deep dived into such questions and once colour and gender were added to the filter it was pretty damning and shocking that so many people felt they had been bullied or harassed and that the majority of those were non white and or female.

there may be an element of snowflake or war on woke about it but at the end of the day we all have different levels we tolerate. The obvious answer is treat others how you expect to be treated and know the line between what is really banter and what isn’t.

it’s a sad fact but I hope she’s one that’s willing to speak up when necessary and fight the good fight too.

Thanks,

She's female and mixed heritage, quiet but also has a bit of a don't mess with me vibe going on and can be pretty blunt when needed.

 

[MickiQ]

Hi, she's in SE London.

best possible place then, as well as obvious IT companies, places like banks and insurance companies are always on the lookout for computer skills.

 

[Anju]

I've no experience of this, but am studying for much more mundane certs in IT support.

What I have found and would caution is there are a lot of companies who will try and charge you a lot of money for training materials you can find for free or for low cost online combined with a certification that you could book yourself for a fraction of the cost.

Yes, she's found some good resources and doesn't part with her money easily.

 

[equationgirl]

Thanks,

She's female and mixed heritage, quiet but also has a bit of a don't mess with me vibe going on and can be pretty blunt when needed.

She's going to be fine. Be professional, be direct but pleasant and above all be able to speak up when boundaries are being cross. It won't be easy but she will be ok.

 

[girasol]

Thanks,

She's female and mixed heritage, quiet but also has a bit of a don't mess with me vibe going on and can be pretty blunt when needed.

A couple of people (men) tried to cross lines with me (inappropriate comments and exclusion due to my gender) but I always stood my corner and also had a don't fucking mess with me attitude, it really is necessary in the industry. On the other hand I also made friends with the nice guys and did a lot of socialising with them. At one point word got our that the few women in the office were being ranked in terms of attractiveness ffs! Nothing got done about it, I only knew because one of the nice guys told me but to be honest, I was a bit meh about the whole thing. The more direct discrimination, including finding out I was being paid less than a younger guy in the same position as me, that really pissed me off and I kicked up a big fuss - and I got a pay rise! Management tried to spin it like it was a bad thing to discuss our salaries with each other but that just made me more angry with them.

The thing about male software engineers is that they are mostly ok, reasonable, intelligent guys. Some of them were arseholes, but you can find them everywhere you go, really. The main issue was management.

 

[Nanker Phelge]

My company does a lot of 'women in tech' encouragement. We've hosted events and worked with Rail Girls

Rails Girls

Rails Girls aim is to give tools and a community for women to understand technology and to build their ideas.

railsgirls.com

 

[Nanker Phelge]

Rails Girls Summer of Code

Rails Girls Summer of Code 2020

railsgirlssummerofcode.org

 

[Sue]

My company does a lot of 'women in tech' encouragement. We've hosted events and worked with Rail Girls

Rails Girls

Rails Girls aim is to give tools and a community for women to understand technology and to build their ideas.

railsgirls.com

Yeah, groups like these are definitely worth a look. See also:

Django Girls is a one-day workshop about programming in Python and Django for women

Join us and become a female developer! Build your first website in Python and Django in a friendly, safe environment.

djangogirls.org

Women Who Code - Empowering women to excel in tech careers

Women Who Code is on a mission to empower diverse women to excel in technology careers. We support engineers, developers, data scientists, architects, designers and other technologists with the resources and community to stay in tech and level up.

www.womenwhocode.com

I'll add any others as I think of them. Apart from the learning stuff, also a very good way to make useful contacts.

While there is some sexist shit (and it's a lot lower key than it used to be), most tech companies are desperate to hire women so in some ways that's in her favour. They're not lowering the bar, I'd say, just realising that you can get good people who've got into it through less traditional routes (ie without having a CS degree). Which is good for everyone I'd say -- helps dilute the tossers a bit...

 

[equationgirl]

As some have said, there's always at least one arsehole in any workplace.

Why, only this morning, I had to deal with one (he likes to order me about. I am professional but direct. No doubt my name is mud).

 

[Anju]

A couple of people (men) tried to cross lines with me (inappropriate comments and exclusion due to my gender) but I always stood my corner and also had a don't fucking mess with me attitude, it really is necessary in the industry. On the other hand I also made friends with the nice guys and did a lot of socialising with them. At one point word got our that the few women in the office were being ranked in terms of attractiveness ffs! Nothing got done about it, I only knew because one of the nice guys told me but to be honest, I was a bit meh about the whole thing. The more direct discrimination, including finding out I was being paid less than a younger guy in the same position as me, that really pissed me off and I kicked up a big fuss - and I got a pay rise! Management tried to spin it like it was a bad thing to discuss our salaries with each other but that just made me more angry with them.

The thing about male software engineers is that they are mostly ok, reasonable, intelligent guys. Some of them were arseholes, but you can find them everywhere you go, really. The main issue was management.

Rails Girls Summer of Code

Rails Girls Summer of Code 2020

railsgirlssummerofcode.org

Thanks, those look great.