No. We have freedom of speech. That means we have the responsibility to let people speak even when we disagree with them. Besides, don't you think it's better to keep tabs on them that way?
Daniel Hannan talking in America about Europe
- Thread starter Quartz
- Start date
No. We have freedom of speech. That means we have the responsibility to let people speak even when we disagree with them. Besides, don't you think it's better to keep tabs on them that way?
stethoscope
Well-Known Member
Where am I criticising his freedom of speech? Fuck me, that lot are the loudest out there! I don't think we need to 'keep a tabs' on people like Hannan because most of their uber-liberalised, 'the market frees us all' nonsense is precisely that.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
A cunt and a cock. That's quite an achievement!
And yet he still won't do what he's told, and go fuck himself! What a shitbag!
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Still be fun to sit him on a wooden bench, nail his bollocks to it, then set free the hounds, though.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
But you do agree with him. Just say it.
binka
!!!!!!!!!
he's a regular on fox news and conservative talk radio over in america. it would be cynical of me to suggest he has noticed how much money can be made from pandering to that kind of audience - they love a well spoken english bloke telling them how wonderful they are and are prepared to pay handsomely for the privilege
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
I did not.
JHE
.
Hannan goes down a bomb with Tories (as well as Yank right-wingers, whom he shamelessly flatters in the recording posted above).
I'm not sure why, from time to time, he says things about the NHS that make it virtually impossible that he could lead the Tories. (In the recording posted above, the question of health care is only mentioned in passing, but he has said more before.)
Possible explanations:
1. He loves being a journalist, commentator, speech-maker and doesn't have high political ambitions
2. He thinks that within 10 or 15 years British politics will have moved sufficiently rightwards on the question of the NHS to catch up with him and somewhere along the way he will become acceptable.
3. He thinks that by making anti-NHS speeches he will strengthen the backbone of the anti-NHS Tory right
4. He lacks the guile to keep his gob shut on the NHS
5. He loves being a well-paid MEP so much that he wants to reduce the risk of becoming an MP
6. He is deeply principled, unlike other Tories
7. Sumfink else... ???
I'm not sure why, from time to time, he says things about the NHS that make it virtually impossible that he could lead the Tories. (In the recording posted above, the question of health care is only mentioned in passing, but he has said more before.)
Possible explanations:
1. He loves being a journalist, commentator, speech-maker and doesn't have high political ambitions
2. He thinks that within 10 or 15 years British politics will have moved sufficiently rightwards on the question of the NHS to catch up with him and somewhere along the way he will become acceptable.
3. He thinks that by making anti-NHS speeches he will strengthen the backbone of the anti-NHS Tory right
4. He lacks the guile to keep his gob shut on the NHS
5. He loves being a well-paid MEP so much that he wants to reduce the risk of becoming an MP
6. He is deeply principled, unlike other Tories
7. Sumfink else... ???
Then perhaps you should differentiate liking a speech because you agree with it from enjoying a speech because it is an enjoyable speech.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Or have enough honesty to say yes, i agree with this fucking loon, his loonicity is something i like. I agree with it in fact.
Fedayn
Well-Known Member
A cunt and a cock. That's quite an achievement!
Good, he can go fuck himself.
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
I'd really, really like to think that we have something called freedom of speech but, given this country's libel laws, our speech is somewhat limited - especially if you're a satirist. Hannan supported The Freedom Association's (he's a member surprise, surprise) call for David Baddiel to be sued, because he made an off-the-cuff remark about Norris McWhirter on 5 Live. In fact, while he was at Oxford, Hannan threatened Cherwell (the Oxford Uni mag) with legal action for referring him as a "xenophobe".When it comes to free speech, Hannan is the biggest hypocrite of all.
ViolentPanda
Hardly getting over it.
Hannan's a politician: I don't expect more, though I do hope for more. I don't recall the either incident, but with regard to your second example you indicate that Cherwell maligned him personally rather than his ideas, which is not on. That's libel, isn't it? Free speech is important to me because I want racists, extremists, lunatics, and other fucktards to be able to speak freely so I know who they are. I want them to speak freely so that satirists can lampoon them and expose them for the idiots they really are. That's what free speech enables. You prevent it and it goes underground, not away.
I enjoyed Hannan's speech. I enjoyed his use of language. I enjoyed his delivery. I don't agree with everything he said in it. But it's his right to say it, and our responsibility to allow him to say it. Because otherwise Cameron might turn round and ban your flavour of speech. Sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander.
Jeff Robinson
Marxist-Lentilist: Jackboots and Jackfruit
A very robust defence of freedom of speech there Quartz, good on you, especially for standing up a marginalised outcast like Mr Hannan who after all has only got speaker's rights in the European Parliament, a column in a national daily, numerous books in the shops and a personal hotline to fux news USA to spew his utterly unrepresentative wank fantasies about reconstructing society around an armed clique of psychopath randian ubermensch enclosing every last ince of the remaining global commons whilst cackling all the while like supercharged meth heads.
stethoscope
Well-Known Member
But Clegg will stop him, lol!
That poor marginalised Hannan who went to Oxford, has a cushty number in the European Parliament and media deals and appearances all over the place!
Srsly, just listen to yourself
Srsly, just listen to yourself
Well exactly. If I don't stand up for everyone, regardless of their politics, someday I may not be able to listen to myself.
As Niemuller said:
First they came for the communists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a communist.
Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.
Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Jew.
Then they came for me
and there was no one left to speak out for me.
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
Either you stand for free speech or you don't. Hannan and TFA's understanding of free speech is extremely narrow. Personally, I think Hannan is a xenophobe and I think most Europhobic Little Englanders are xenophobes. I have the right to call him that if I so wish. Those with economic power - like Hannan - can use their money-muscle to harass people who criticise them. If he disagreed with the label that Cherwell has assigned him, would it not have been a better idea to challenge them with ideas? The bottom line is that Hannan and his chums don't have any ideas beyond those which have been produced by economic cultists like the Ludwig von Mises Institute.
Jeff Robinson
Marxist-Lentilist: Jackboots and Jackfruit
oh dear lord Quartz, if Niemuller had said 'first they came for the Nazis' then you might be on to something here.
Actually, no you don't, because that might be slander or libel. Unless you can back that up with details of actual actions. You have the right to call his ideas xenophobic. See the difference? You are, of course, aware that he was born in Peru?
I wasn't aware Hannan was seriously rich. He's on the Euro gravy train, of course, so he's doing quite well, but I wasn't aware that he was sufficiently rich to have money-muscle.
And such is his right.
Random
Ethnic nalgocrat
So what bits do you agree with?
I owe you an apology. I do agree with him on one point: the legalisation of drugs.
Jeff Robinson
Marxist-Lentilist: Jackboots and Jackfruit
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Isn't it refreshing to have a privately educated oxbridge boy like Hannan speaking out for a change?
Nylock
I hate 'these days'...
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Plenty of other people who aren't raving privileged loons who think the same way.
nino_savatte
No pasaran!
I am entitled to an opinion and if I cannt express that opinion because someone threatens me with legal action, that isn't "free speech". I know Hannan comes from Peru where his parents own a chicken farm. They also own a cotton plantation in Bolivia, so he isn't short a bob or two.
Yes, he is seriously rich, those who tend to worship at the feet of Von Mises and Rand tend to have a great deal of personal wealth.
And I have the right to refer to him as "Randist pencil neck", if I so wish. However Hannan's economic narratives are anchored in his social class, and he uses these narraitves to justify the further enrichment of himself and his fellow travellers at the expense of the least fortunate in society. That, Quartz, is a form of social Darwinism.
Have you read any Rand btw?
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