Champagne & Fromage opening in Brixton soon
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Monkeygrinder's Organ
Dodgy geezer swilling vapid lager
I vote we take off and nuke Brixton from orbit. It's the only way to be sure.
Nanker Phelge
Leave the gun. Take the cannoli.
New album by The Fall?
Nanker Phelge
Leave the gun. Take the cannoli.
When I'm faced with a big decision like this I always ask 'What would T.J Hooker do?'
editor
hiraethified
That very much depends on what you do. If you're a freelance technology writer, for example, then you'd need to get a decent smartphone to be able to run and review the latest software, not that any of this desperate, barrel-scraping, point-scoring nonsense has the slightest bit to do with the issue of the growing inequality and social deprivation in the Coldharbour ward.
Still it's good to see where your priorities in this area lie.
Or perhaps to be able to purchase laptops to design menus and websites for bars selling champagne? At pretty much the same price. And then use the same laptop to promote protests against other bars selling champers... On the basis that it was a favour for a friend? Hypocrisy writ large.
This new joint looks awful but the lounge was was most certainly the thin end of the wedge.
editor
hiraethified
For the last time you fucking obsessed weirdo: when I designed the tiny website for the Lounge over TEN years ago, it was a cheapo cafe. It didn't serve champagne, just tea and coffee. And juice too.
teuchter
je suis teuchter
Ah, so you need to buy flashy high end gadgets in order to write reviews of them so that other people can make informed decisions when they buy their flashy high end gadgets.
It sounds a bit like making a living out of facilitating a luxury market. Not so different from what the owners of C&F do, perhaps.
For the last time you fucking obsessed weirdo: when I designed the tiny website for the Lounge over TEN years ago, it was a cheapo cafe. It didn't serve champagne, just tea and coffee. And juice too.
Post reported.
Personal abuse. You fucking hypocritical weirdo. You designed a website advertising champagne then promoted a protest against a place on the basis that it sells champagne.
editor
hiraethified
If - in your increasingly desperate quest to score personal points - you care to ignore the issues of a widening poverty gap, social deprivation and the process of pricing out traditional businesses and the local community, yes, It's exactly the same.
Once again it's good to see where your priorities lie here.
editor
hiraethified
When did I do this please?
editor
hiraethified
The didn't serve champagne. I have the original website in front of me right now, not that the contents of a ten year old site is even remotely relevant to anything but your increasingly obsessed mind.
Is there any chance of you discussing the actual issues under debate here now?
Monkeygrinder's Organ
Dodgy geezer swilling vapid lager
All queued up for another lap then?
It seems to me there are two strands to the seemingly endless cycle on here. Firstly there's a tendency to divide people into Bad People (yuppies, hipsters, newcomers, anyone who's bought a burger at any point) and Good People (old skool Brixton). The line is never going to be clear though and it's always going to result in endless bickering and accusations of hypocrisy (sometimes quite justified IMHO). It gets people's backs up and it's not really a very useful explanation of what's happening IMO.
The second is what tends towards a pure free-market argument. People's money is their own and they can spend it on what they want (some of the people involved would deny that's their view I'm sure but that's essentially how the argument functions). The end result being to ignore (or disregard the importance of) the very real changes that have been going on. 'But Bouji's South is only slightly more expensive than Champagne and Fromage, what's the problem?'
I think it would be helpful to be able to look at people's behaviours in a way that doesn't put them into groups quite so much. So to take Honest Burger, say, is everyone in there a terrible person, waving their bundles of cash at the poor? No not really. They're just in there buying a burger at a price that isn't beyond the means of most people, some of time at least. It's not an unreasonable way to behave IMO. But is the place a gentrifying influence? Yeah, it clearly is. Is it possible for the thread to look at that without there being a fight? Dunno.
I'm not taking the Champagne Bar as example though because that is taking the piss a bit.
It seems to me there are two strands to the seemingly endless cycle on here. Firstly there's a tendency to divide people into Bad People (yuppies, hipsters, newcomers, anyone who's bought a burger at any point) and Good People (old skool Brixton). The line is never going to be clear though and it's always going to result in endless bickering and accusations of hypocrisy (sometimes quite justified IMHO). It gets people's backs up and it's not really a very useful explanation of what's happening IMO.
The second is what tends towards a pure free-market argument. People's money is their own and they can spend it on what they want (some of the people involved would deny that's their view I'm sure but that's essentially how the argument functions). The end result being to ignore (or disregard the importance of) the very real changes that have been going on. 'But Bouji's South is only slightly more expensive than Champagne and Fromage, what's the problem?'
I think it would be helpful to be able to look at people's behaviours in a way that doesn't put them into groups quite so much. So to take Honest Burger, say, is everyone in there a terrible person, waving their bundles of cash at the poor? No not really. They're just in there buying a burger at a price that isn't beyond the means of most people, some of time at least. It's not an unreasonable way to behave IMO. But is the place a gentrifying influence? Yeah, it clearly is. Is it possible for the thread to look at that without there being a fight? Dunno.
I'm not taking the Champagne Bar as example though because that is taking the piss a bit.
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editor
hiraethified
Indeed. And they've just set down a big fat marker for other similar businesses to come in.
A £50,000 marker.
teuchter
je suis teuchter
Instead of responding to the actual points raised, you try and distract and dismiss by making a false accusation that I am "ignoring" these issues. Arrogant, manipulative disingenuity. Business as usual.
TruXta
tired
Sensible argument? Fuck that, you fucking weirdo.
Monkeygrinder's Organ
Dodgy geezer swilling vapid lager
Sensible argument? Fuck that, you fucking weirdo.
Well seeing as editor and teuchter show no signs of finally sorting out an actual proper fight we need to go somewhere.
TruXta
tired
Who knows, maybe they have bi-annual showdowns in the back streets of Brixton, Fight Club style.
el-ahrairah
forward communism, forward gerbils!
if only they would.
Rushy
basically a scrotum
[Didn't mean to post that first bit - bloody draft saving!]
The leaseholders who sold to C&F are, I understand, the same leaseholders who sold Honest the lease to the adjacent site and who are also looking to sell the site opposite Honest. The premium was much lower when they sold the Honest site.
The rent being paid to the market remains unchanged. The high premium paid to the outgoing leaseholder reflects the low rent of the existing lease.
It appears to be existing longer term leaseholders who are calling the shots on the premium.
Pretty sure that the premium was paid to the outgoing tenants (leaseholders). That's the way it normally works and I have been told by a friend who owns one of the shops that this is what happened here. I don't think anyone taking over an unlet unit had to pay a premium to the market but maybe fortyplus could confirm?
The leaseholders who sold to C&F are, I understand, the same leaseholders who sold Honest the lease to the adjacent site and who are also looking to sell the site opposite Honest. The premium was much lower when they sold the Honest site.
The rent being paid to the market remains unchanged. The high premium paid to the outgoing leaseholder reflects the low rent of the existing lease.
It appears to be existing longer term leaseholders who are calling the shots on the premium.
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lang rabbie
Je ne regrette les gazebos
Interesting - so we actually need to know ALL of the value of premium paid, the length of the remaining lease, AND the annual rent being paid to the market landlord before being able to work out what the annual outgoings actually are, and how exposed some of these businesses may be if Brixton Village ceases to be the next big thing.
Rushy
basically a scrotum
To be fair to gabi (and the Lounge), I never remember it being a cheapo cafe. I've no idea whether it used to sell champagne but its general offering has remained fairly consistent over the years. I don't believe anyone thought of it as a cheapo cafe when it launched. It was immediately a big step up from anything else nearby.For the last time you fucking obsessed weirdo: when I designed the tiny website for the Lounge over TEN years ago, it was a cheapo cafe. It didn't serve champagne, just tea and coffee. And juice too.
leanderman
Street Party: July 2
So the existing leaseholders can now realise windfalls of £50k?
Does this mean the gentrification of the market is not wholly bad for them, at least those who want/have to/need/forced to leave?
