Brexit party on 31 January in London is going ahead. And it will be shit.

[Proper Tidy]

I think this exceptionalism applied to UK is pretty dangerous tbh

Germany AfD: Thuringia PM quits amid fury over far right

The AfD helped elect liberal Thomas Kemmerich in Thuringia, prompting widespread outrage.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Mr Moose]

There's a German poster on here who moved back to Germany because he saw a rise in exactly this kind of thing. Not going to tag him and drag him into this sewer of a discussion, but regardless of this particular situation, do you question the general thrust? As for expecting action, the quoted piece doesn't say what action was taken. Of course most people would be horrified by disgusting incidents like this. That's not really the point, is it? Doesn't take 'most people' to ruin someone's day.

Clearly there has been anti European racism in the UK. That should alarm everyone and I wouldn’t blame anyone being upset about it for a minute.

 

[scifisam]

And it’s simply not like people in the UK to be obsessed with the war.

But really? I’m a little bit sceptical. Did Ann make a complaint and how was it dealt with? Pretty hardcore calling a small child a ‘Nazi’. Maybe I’m in denial, but you’d expect action.

You've clearly never been to a mother and toddler group. They can be fantastic places of support and fun, but they can also feature really horrible and slightly insane people.

 

[Mr Moose]

You've clearly never been to a mother and toddler group. They can be fantastic places of support and fun, but they can also feature really horrible and slightly insane people.

I’ve been to lots of play groups, drop ins, one o’clock clubs etc (back in the day). I think Dads may get off lightly at them.

 

[The39thStep]

Here's the former President of the EU giving his insights into climate change

 

[scifisam]

I’ve been to lots of play groups, drop ins, one o’clock clubs etc (back in the day). I think Dads may get off lightly at them.

Yeah, they might do. Or you just got lucky I've heard some horror stories, though usually it's other Mums being extremely judgmental rather than xenophobic. Course, someone could make a Nazi comment without entirely meaning to be horribly offensive, too.

 

[The39thStep]

You've clearly never been to a mother and toddler group. They can be fantastic places of support and fun, but they can also feature really horrible and slightly insane people.

I did a placement at one when I was doing social work training . it was like a serpents nest

 

[Proper Tidy]

I got called a saturday dad at a messy play which fucked me off cos I'm not, I took her to this group every week, and it was a wednesday

 

[oryx]

And it’s simply not like people in the UK to be obsessed with the war.

But really? I’m a little bit sceptical. Did Ann make a complaint and how was it dealt with? Pretty hardcore calling a small child a ‘Nazi’. Maybe I’m in denial, but you’d expect action.

Even if a complaint was made and those running the playgroup dealt with it appropriately, it was still said, which is the point.

 

[Mr Moose]

I got called a saturday dad at a messy play which fucked me off cos I'm not, I took her to this group every week, and it was a wednesday

Lightweight m8. The mums sussed you

 

[Mr Moose]

Yeah, they might do. Or you just got lucky I've heard some horror stories, though usually it's other Mums being extremely judgmental rather than xenophobic. Course, someone could make a Nazi comment without entirely meaning to be horribly offensive, too.

Well I mentioned the war but...I think I got away with it.

 

[ska invita]

I think this exceptionalism applied to UK is pretty dangerous tbh

I know we go around in circles on this for years now but didn't we just talk this through yesterday?

It's not about being exceptional, it's about the role Brexit has within the wider dynamic.

 

[treelover]

Yep. Tomorrow belongs to me videos are being posted up and there are still crude attempts to portray the leave vote as driven almost exclusively by racism. And yes, there have been equally robust responses. Aside from trying to influence post Brexit trade deals and the like (fairly hopeless task, tbh), the left(s) should be getting into 'beyond brexit' mode. All that energy that could have been spent fighting the cuts...

even on here , 'the cuts' as an issue disappeared years ago.

 

[Mr Moose]

Even if a complaint was made and those running the playgroup dealt with it appropriately, it was still said, which is the point.

And that’s bad, no doubt. A bit of context would be helpful that’s all.

But I visited the fb page and it was interesting to read people’s thoughts and their experiences, both sad and positive.

 

[Proper Tidy]

I know we go around in circles on this for years now but didn't we just talk this through yesterday?

It's not about being exceptional, it's about the role Brexit has within the wider dynamic.

Yeah we had that debate. My point was about this, dunno what you call it, meme of people fleeing UK for liberal europe. When racism & chauvinism on the rise and far right growing everywhere, arguably stronger with greater support in germany, france, italy, spain, netherlands, greece...

 

[scifisam]

Yeah we had that debate. My point was about this, dunno what you call it, meme of people fleeing UK for liberal europe. When racism & chauvinism on the rise and far right growing everywhere, arguably stronger with greater support in germany, france, italy, spain, netherlands, greece...

Isn't it about people going back to their home countries though? There's probably rather less xenophobia against you in the country you're from.

 

[Proper Tidy]

Isn't it about people going back to their home countries though? There's probably rather less xenophobia against you in the country you're from.

Probably. I don't mean the people choosing to move, why shouldn't they, not my business what people choose to do and everybody has to do what they want to do to be happy. It's that people are used for rhetoric which exceptionalises situation in UK when it isn't exceptional

 

[editor]

Here's the former President of the EU giving his insights into climate change

Irrelevant dinosaur who should shut the fuck up.

 

[ska invita]

Yeah we had that debate. My point was about this, dunno what you call it, meme of people fleeing UK for liberal europe. When racism & chauvinism on the rise and far right growing everywhere, arguably stronger with greater support in germany, france, italy, spain, netherlands, greece...

Well yes, if anyone moves that's their business, all kinds of reasons to weigh up, but the idea grass is deep greener elsewhere in the world doesn't hold up.

 

[The39thStep]

I know we go around in circles on this for years now but didn't we just talk this through yesterday?

It's not about being exceptional, it's about the role Brexit has within the wider dynamic.

or how the wider dynamic played out on the Brexit campaign .

 

[Raheem]

Probably. I don't mean the people choosing to move, why shouldn't they, not my business what people choose to do and everybody has to do what they want to do to be happy. It's that people are used for rhetoric which exceptionalises situation in UK when it isn't exceptional

Think Sam's point is that the UK isn't being exceptionalised in this case. The idea that people think Europeans are returning to Europe because it's 'liberal' is obviously false. Where else are they expected to return to?

 

[RTWL]

The sheeple really need to wake up to this

Well the government has so sombody should really tell them sheeple to wake the fuck up!

Electoral law ‘not fit for purpose’

from the government report :

• Read the report: Disinformation and ‘fake news’: Final Report
• Read the full report: Disinformation and ‘fake news’: Final Report (PDF)
• Read the Disinformation and 'fake news' Shorthand
• Inquiry: Disinformation and ‘fake news’

here is the bit about the Russian Hackers :

Disinformation and 'fake news': Final Report - Digital, Culture, Media and Sport Committee - House of Commons

publications.parliament.uk

time to come clean Marty1

 

[The39thStep]

Think Sam's point is that the UK isn't being exceptionalised in this case. The idea that people think Europeans are returning to Europe because it's 'liberal' is obviously false. Where else are they expected to return to?

Biggest driver for the number of Polish leaving is the boyuancy of the Polish economy and wage rises

 

[Proper Tidy]

Think Sam's point is that the UK isn't being exceptionalised in this case. The idea that people think Europeans are returning to Europe because it's 'liberal' is obviously false. Where else are they expected to return to?

Well it was being exceptionalised in the post I responded to with a comment about it being exceptionalised. Which was some time before Sam's post. Are you reading the thread backwards?

I agree though tbf, with the where else are they expected bit

 

[Ax^]

time to come clean Marty1

you'll be lucky

 

[Marty1]

Biggest driver for the number of Polish leaving is the boyuancy of the Polish economy and wage rises

Yeah, quite a few polish drivers have returned to Poland for work now (well before Brexit).

 

[Humberto]

I suppose everyone has to make their own mind up. We are all subject to domination at home and abroad unless you are a member of the ruling class. Brutal austerity preceded the referendum. Where was the Parliamentary Labour Party then? Those that rule in their own interest and pass the laws that govern us; well perhaps people saw that as a pressing issue: 'taking control for ourselves'. Many could in the end support neither option, or could do so only reluctantly. The fact that racists have been emboldened is shit, and is not an exercise in debate for those who receive it. It is rooted to an extent in a societal slide into indecency and reactionary politics at the bidding of those who dissemble for their own profit. The referendum had to be ratified. The people demanded it of their rulers and the Tories won a landslide off that one simple promise. So, do I think that is a good thing? No I don't. Nothing good came from Cameron and Osborne in Downing Street. They are what they are. We knew it was going to be shit, charted and discussed its shitness and it will continue to be shit for the foreseeable.

In my own selfish concerns, losing the right to live and work anywhere in the EU is a big loss in freedom. And I should have more respect and sympathy for those who have built lives here, whose situations are now uncertain. The shower of shit at the wheel in Westminster now aren't going to do any of us any good. Populist figures like Farage too, aren't going to just disappear. And it won't suddenly all just become ok if Labour get their act together. The interests of the working class and the people that govern us (or on the ruling classes behalf) do not coincide. We, the working class, are losing and have been for a long time. And it seems to be sliding ever downwards. I don't think taking the piss out of Leave voters gets anyone very far. Time is in short supply it looks like to me. How to turn the tide?

 

[Marty1]

I suppose everyone has to make their own mind up. We are all subject to domination at home and abroad unless you are a member of the ruling class. Brutal austerity preceded the referendum. Where was the Parliamentary Labour Party then? Those that rule in their own interest and pass the laws that govern us; well perhaps people saw that as a pressing issue: 'taking control for ourselves'. Many could in the end support neither option, or could do so only reluctantly. The fact that racists have been emboldened is shit, and is not an exercise in debate for those who receive it. It is rooted to an extent in a societal slide into indecency and reactionary politics at the bidding of those who dissemble for their own profit. The referendum had to be ratified. The people demanded it of their rulers and the Tories won a landslide off that one simple promise. So, do I think that is a good thing? No I don't. Nothing good came from Cameron and Osborne in Downing Street. They are what they are. We knew it was going to be shit, charted and discussed its shitness and it will continue to be shit for the foreseeable.

In my own selfish concerns, losing the right to live and work anywhere in the EU is a big loss in freedom. And I should have more respect and sympathy for those who have built lives here, whose situations are now uncertain. The shower of shit at the wheel in Westminster now aren't going to do any of us any good. Populist figures like Farage too, aren't going to just disappear. And it won't suddenly all just become ok if Labour get their act together. The interests of the working class and the people that govern us (or on the ruling classes behalf) do not coincide. We, the working class, are losing and have been for a long time. And it seems to be sliding ever downwards. I don't think taking the piss out of Leave voters gets anyone very far. Time is in short supply it looks like to me. How to turn the tide?

An economic boom would be a good start - a rising tide lifts all boats etc.

 

[Identitarian]

This event was quite a success, thousands turned out and celebrated a democratic British victory.

 

[Serge Forward]

Fuck off.