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Critique of Climate Camp action 17/18 October

this article has created a discussion that is a bit too much for indymedia's newswire to handle. people were crying out for somewhere to continue the discussion so I thought I'd repost it here. I'll just notify the thread on Indymedia, then pile in with my comments cos this is something I have a lof of opinions about. Hope this is considered suitable use of the forum (if not then i won't be offended if any mods delete it):

http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/regions/nottinghamshire/2009/09/438072.html

ETA: I should summarise that the article's main focus of criticism is related to the slogan “It’s time to start imagining a future without coal” and that this feels like nothing has been learnt from the past few years of climate politics where these slogans have been questioned quite thoroughly.
 
DS, I think we're quite clear on your opinions without 'someone you chatted to' coming into it ;)
 
Comments from someone I chatted to the other day who went.
:mad:
DEREK:
I saw this bloke the other day.
CLIVE:
No, did you?
DEREK:
Did I tell you?
CLIVE:
No! You d- .....
DEREK:
Yeah.
CLIVE:
No, you didn't, I don't fucking b- ..... don't come that with me!
DEREK:
No, really, I know .....
CLIVE:
You saw this bloke the other day?
DEREK:
Yeah.
CLIVE:
You don't expect me to believe that, do you?
DEREK:
I don't, no, I don't.
CLIVE:
Oh, that's outrageous that is.
DEREK:
What, I know.
CLIVE:
That's outrageous.
DEREK:
Yeah, but .....
CLIVE:
You saw this bloke the other day! Ha ha!
DEREK:
No, It's true an' all, it's true.
CLIVE:
Oh, come off it, you cunt!
DEREK:
Yeah, huh huh huh.
CLIVE:
"Saw this bloke the other day", you cunt!
DEREK:
I saw him. I saw him.
CLIVE:
Course you didn't, you never saw a bloke the other day.
DEREK:
I saw him.
CLIVE:
How could you have done?
DEREK:
I don't know. That's what .....
CLIVE:
Well, all right .....
DEREK:
..... that's what I, that's what, er, defied, er, er, description .....
CLIVE:
All right.
DEREK:
I saw him and I don't know how! I don't know how I saw him, but I saw him! I was going along the street and I saw this bloke.
CLIVE:
Yeah, no, come on, what proof have you fucking got that you saw this bloke.
DEREK:
I got no proof. All right, no, .....
CLIVE:
What, what, what proof, what proof have you got?
DEREK:
I've got no proof, mate.
CLIVE:
What proof?
DEREK:
Just .....
CLIVE:
Well, without proof there's no fucking point in talking, is there?
DEREK:
Well, there is .....
CLIVE:
I can prove that I'm here 'cause I've got a witness.
DEREK:
Who?
CLIVE:
You!
DEREK:
I ..... where are you?
CLIVE:
I'm here, cunt! Can't you see me? Cuh ..... You talk about some bloke you saw the other day .....
DEREK:
Yeah.
CLIVE:
Yeah, O.K., you've seen a bloke, have you? So what's so good about that?
DEREK:
Nothing. Nothing, I .....
CLIVE:
What's so interesting about this particular story?
DEREK:
There's noth-, I just wanted to tell you, I saw this bloke.
CLIVE:
You saw a bloke, er, er, you saw a bloke, you saw a bloke, so, so what, so, you saw him. So what happened?
DEREK:
Nothing happened.
CLIVE:
Any happier? You any happier? You feeling better for seeing this bloke? Course you aren't!
DEREK:
I didn't say I'd feel better.
CLIVE:
WHY RAISE IT IN THE FIRST FUCKING PLACE THEN?!
DEREK:
I thought you might be interested.
CLIVE:
I wasn't in the least interested! I was sitting here quietly wanking.
DEREK:
How would I know?
CLIVE:
How would you know? By fucking intuition, mate! Can't you have something intuitive?
DEREK:
All right, I saw this, this, this woman.
CLIVE:
That's better.
DEREK:
Right.
CLIVE:
Now you're talking.
 
On a brief skim that actually looks like quite a sensible and mature series of comments, without anyone calling anyone else a cunt - are you sure this is the right place to continue it?

more seriously, go ahead by all means, I think that's okay
 
Article was way off for me. In fact, I was quite confused by it at first.

I would assume "no coal", in the context of Climate Camp, means "no coal power plants".

The writer says that it means no coal whatsoever for anything. :confused:
 
This comment:

But the action is at a power station pissing the coal into the strattosphere, as you put it. Not at a mine or a steel-works.

Sums up my thoughts on that article nicely. A pity really, apart from gratuitous overuse (ie. one instance) of the phrase 'let's get real' it's not a bad article, it just seems to be presented in entirely the wrong context. Making issues out of things that aren't really issues is a great talent of the activist movement, and one that's often had me headbutting walls in frustration :(
 
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