Sheridan wins libel case
- Thread starter junius
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Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
I've no axe to grind on this, but i don't really see it as compliance. It was Sheridan who brought the case - and these were the people who did make some kind of effort to keep the damning minute away from the court (from the little i've read here or elsewhere).fanciful said:
What/whoever's fault, this has pretty much fucked the party
DexterTCN
Troy and Abed in the morning
Well the party have brought it on themselves imo.
Going against another socialist for the fucking Murdoch rags, never mind the obvious political reasons of the NotW for going after Sheridan and drawing in the whole SSP? Fuck em.
And what for...coz someone might have been shagging? You've got to be joking.
Fighting in a fucking court calling each other liars. Game over for these amatuers and the socialists in Scotland can start again.
Can I hear Gorgeous George on his way up the A1?
Going against another socialist for the fucking Murdoch rags, never mind the obvious political reasons of the NotW for going after Sheridan and drawing in the whole SSP? Fuck em.
And what for...coz someone might have been shagging? You've got to be joking.
Fighting in a fucking court calling each other liars. Game over for these amatuers and the socialists in Scotland can start again.
Can I hear Gorgeous George on his way up the A1?
Fullyplumped
in a personal capacity
It is an interesting video, basically because they've all completely lost sight of the bigger picture. The "truth" about Sheridan's love life is neither here nor there. This was a court case brought by the NOW in order to attack Sheridan in an attempt to discredit and undermine socialism. These "United Left" supported the NOW in that attack. That is an appalling error of judgement. They supported the class enemy. Frankly its irrelevent if they thought they were telling the "truth" about Sheridan's love life. It was no business of theirs in the first place.
JHE
.
You are very repetitive, fanciful, and you don't become any more convincing. The SSP Exec did not want the case. They did not moan about Sheridan's allegedly odd sex life. You have not explained what option they had, once they had been ordered to give evidence, other than to give their evidence or lie at the behest of the Dear Leader.
There is one other thing here on which I disagree with you. The News of the Screws, and similar papers, do this sort of expose of politicians' sexual exploits regardless of party. (They also do it to non-politicos.) Maybe for some in the Murdoch empire there was an added pleasure in embarrassing a lefty politician, but they'd do the same to a Blairite, a Tory, a Lib Dem... Surely you can't have missed the fact that they have done exactly that.
I feel quite sorry for the SSP.
There is one other thing here on which I disagree with you. The News of the Screws, and similar papers, do this sort of expose of politicians' sexual exploits regardless of party. (They also do it to non-politicos.) Maybe for some in the Murdoch empire there was an added pleasure in embarrassing a lefty politician, but they'd do the same to a Blairite, a Tory, a Lib Dem... Surely you can't have missed the fact that they have done exactly that.
I feel quite sorry for the SSP.
Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
I find the logic behind this post nauseating. You are saying that if some high profile personality gets himself into some kind of struggle with the gutter press that becomes some kind of 'class politics' (not necessarily the case anyway). This then means that everyone else has to fall into line and lie. More than that, they have to fall into line with personal attacks on sheridan's former girlfriend. Thats the worst possible 'ends justifies the means' argument.fanciful said:
This is really about sheridan's vanity. He's willing to destroy his own party and his long term comrades rather than have the guts to give a simple 'fuck off' when the press started enquiring about his sex life.
Fullyplumped
in a personal capacity
Forget an appeal by the News of the World.
If this goes back to court it will be because Tommy Sheridan gets indicted to appear at the High Court on perjury charges. The police are gathering evidence (BBC video).
If this goes back to court it will be because Tommy Sheridan gets indicted to appear at the High Court on perjury charges. The police are gathering evidence (BBC video).
JHE
.
I think fanciful is part of the Workers' Powder faction that was recently expelled by the even nuttier Workers' Powderites.laptop said:
The Social Workers are taking the fanciful line. They must think there's something in it for themselves, Galloway etc in the destruction of the SSP.
There's no need to accuse F of lying. Trots get worked up to promote the line and kid themselves first, the better to try to kid others.
CWI Scotland Stsatement
http://www.cwiscotland.org/
Tommy Sheridan has won his libel action against the News of the World and Rupert Murdoch’s media empire. It is a victory not only for Tommy Sheridan, but for socialists and the left internationally over one of the most reactionary, anti-working class news organisations in the world. The Committee for a Workers International welcomes this result.
The jury’s verdict was that Tommy Sheridan was defamed by articles written in the NoW in 2004 and 2005 which accused him of having affairs, visiting swingers clubs for group sex and taking alcohol and cocaine.
His victory was all the more remarkable given the fact that 11 members of the Scottish Socialist Party’s Executive Committee, including three MSP’s gave evidence that Tommy Sheridan had admitted visiting a swingers club in Manchester. The SSP leaderships evidence formed a central plank of the NoW’s defence. 11 of the 18 witnesses called by the NoW were SSP members and as the NoW’s main claim against Tommy Sheridan – that of a four-year affair – fell to pieces during the month long trial they increasingly relied on the SSP witnesses.
Continues http://www.cwiscotland.org/
http://www.cwiscotland.org/
Tommy Sheridan has won his libel action against the News of the World and Rupert Murdoch’s media empire. It is a victory not only for Tommy Sheridan, but for socialists and the left internationally over one of the most reactionary, anti-working class news organisations in the world. The Committee for a Workers International welcomes this result.
The jury’s verdict was that Tommy Sheridan was defamed by articles written in the NoW in 2004 and 2005 which accused him of having affairs, visiting swingers clubs for group sex and taking alcohol and cocaine.
His victory was all the more remarkable given the fact that 11 members of the Scottish Socialist Party’s Executive Committee, including three MSP’s gave evidence that Tommy Sheridan had admitted visiting a swingers club in Manchester. The SSP leaderships evidence formed a central plank of the NoW’s defence. 11 of the 18 witnesses called by the NoW were SSP members and as the NoW’s main claim against Tommy Sheridan – that of a four-year affair – fell to pieces during the month long trial they increasingly relied on the SSP witnesses.
Continues http://www.cwiscotland.org/
q_w_e_r_t_y said:
There you have it. Someone on the SSP exec gave 'their recollections of the meeting' along with an affidavit to the press. Now, if those 'recollections' included Tommy admitting to anything that he was denying in court then that would certainly suggest that someone on the exec wasn't exactly being dragged to court kicking and screaming... In fact, it would suggest that someone on the executive was going out of their way to damage Tommy.
If I were on a jury and I heard that people on the SSP executive were going out of their way to damage Sheridan then I'd think they were disloyal and be inclined to believe that there must have been a conspiricy to get him - that would make it easy for me not to believe them, regardless of how many there were.
Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
No, it would have been better if Sheridan hadn't started playing ego games with the gutter press. For what its worth i hope this really damages the NoW - financially and circulation wise (though i don' think it will). They are scum - Murdoch is scum. they are also anti-working class - isn't the slightest disagreement over that. The people on the jury probably also shared that opinion - accounting for the verdict.fanciful said:
The problem is that Sheridan put his own ego ahead of basic, decent dealings with his long term comrades. He ended up mounting personal attacks on them in a public court and leaving them open to perjury charges (though, in the end, it might well be he who ends up facing perjury charges). From being a working class politician with some integrity (over things like taking a workers wage) he ends up having some pretty unpleasant parallels with Jeffrey Archer (legally and personally).
Bear said:
but they were not going out of their way to be damage sheridan. every one protested about being there and were brought to court via court order. what exactly were they to do? what would you do?
what i dont think people understand is that the SSP and not some secret squirrel little sect comprising of 2 trots and a dog but a party committed to internal democracy-and that includes minuiting decisons made. what is strange about this? what the 11 were asked to do was to lie to themsleves, the court, but far more importantly the general public and membership of the ssp as to the reasons for TS`s departure. why should they do this?
there was no conspiracy to get TS. more importantly there is nothing politically to divide the sides- and in this point lies the good news in all of this. left unity will survive in scotland
JimPage said:
If I were ordered to go to court in a libel trial I'd go to court and tell the truth. I'd expect anyone to do the same.
However, what I am saying is that if I were on the jury and I learned that someone on the exec voluntarily gave the press information that could harm Tommy Sheridan and/or his case against the NOtW then I could only conclude that at least one person on the SSP Executive was 'out to get him'. Despite them saying they didn't wanna testify I could only conclude that actions (information and an avidavitt to the press) spoke louder than words. And if I were on the jury I'd be inclined not to believe people if I thought they might be part of a conspircy out to get him. And you wonder why they reached the verdict they did...
You maybe don't see that but it's clear as day to me; and I suspect the jury saw that too, I imagine that played a big part in them not believing the 18 witnesses.
Now, are you saying that the information to the press isn't evidence of someone being out to get him?
belboid
Exasperated, not angry.
but he hadnt done any such thing. he set it up on the basis of them (NotW) not being able to prove there allegations. Had the minute not been leaked maybe it would never have cme up at all, and so the whole shit could have been avoided.
Whoever handed it over to the right-wing press should be shot.
Whoever handed it over to the right-wing press should be shot.
4thwrite said:
C'mon, you can't expect anyone to buy that. Getting their defence in first? It's hard to see how going to the press with an affidavit before the trial claiming that Tommy did/admitted to xyz is going to help their defense since an affidavit and a talk to a journalist doesn't count for anymore than a testimony under oath.
If the jury heard of disloyality and backstabbing like that then its hardly suprising if they thought there must be some on the SSP exec out to screw Tommy and hence didn't believe them. It's very hard to be sure someone is telling the truth if you've got reason to suspect that they might have an axe to grind.
I'm not disputing that at least some of those who gave evidence against Tommy Sheridan didn't want too go to court. What I am saying is that when senior member(s) on the party's executive decide to approach the press with details and an affidavit that could damage to their so called comrade's case one cannot but think that at least some of them must have wanted to 'get him'. Since that appears to be the case it's not suprising if the jury then believed Tommy when he said he was the victim of a campaign to undermine him. There is a huge difference between giving information when you have too (i.e. telling the truth under oath) and choosing to give information (i.e. approaching the press).
DexterTCN
Troy and Abed in the morning
Arseholes.Macullam said:
Talk about sour grapes. Let me put it more simply...the SSP was and is Tommy Sheridan.
Firstly, I've nothing to declare in this story - apart from I voted SSP in the Livvy local elections for Gillian years ago.
But to be honest I'd rather have Tommy Sheridan as a productive, media savvy MP/MSP than this bunch of idiots. No offence to them personally, I pretty much like their politics in a vaguely unrealistic sort of way.
If they had had the SSP's welfare at help they would have shut the fuck up and welcomed him back with open arms and camera smiles, pretty much guaranteeing at least holding their seats at teh next election if not better.
Arseholes.
I'm with Tommy on this one, at least he has a brain in his head. I give as much of a fuck about some lucky bastards getting 3-somes as I do about Monica Lewinsky.
Ths current SSP are merely doing what Murdoch was doing.
btw I think they stole that Jason's Ear thing from the Scotsman the other day.
Fullyplumped
in a personal capacity
You're quite keen on Gorgeous George too, aren't you?DexterTCN said:
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