Apparently, Feminism is dead!!!

[Treacle Toes]

Feminism – a spent force or fit for the 21st century?

Feminism is dead, says Netmums. As feminist activists prepare to lobby parliament, we bring together a group of female thinkers to discuss the rights and roles of women – and men – in society

• 
• • Yvonne Roberts
  • The Observer,Sunday 21 October 2012
  • Jump to comments (184)

From left: Fiona Ranford, a leading member of UK Feminista; Rehana Azan, senior trade union official; Yvonne Roberts, Observer chief leader writer; Melissa Kite. columnist. Photograph: Andy Hall for the Observer

http://www.guardian.co.uk/theobserver/2012/oct/21/feminism-fit-for-21st-century

As a woman, I appreciate being told.

 

[Vintage Paw]

The Netmums thing was interesting. It's worth noting it was a self-selecting 'study' of people who are members of or read/visit netmums, for a start. There were lots of questions about being a mum, and considering the platform for the study, it's hardly surprising that lots of them were going to say "issues around being a mum are important to me."

It highlighted how "feminism" is such a dirty word to a lot of people. There are plenty of women who want to see things like equal pay, equal choices, equal representation, and so on, but who don't think they are a 'feminist' nor want to be one, because of negative connotations attached to the word. Those negative connotations, by the way, don't all come from in-fighting between various types of feminism over the years; in large part they come from a rabid media that's made sure it has demonised the word as much as possible, along with plenty of commentators for whom it would be just great if women would stfu and just learn to fit in with the status quo.

 

[XR75]

Or because there's plenty of nutters in it.

 

[Firky]

Or because there's plenty of nutters in it.

Can you provide an example?

 

[Balbi]

Speaking as a netmum

 

[Maurice Picarda]

No flowers, presumably.

 

[Hocus Eye.]

"Feminism is dead says Netmums" Is Netmums being ironic? As if a website which is a forum can be said to "say" anything.

 

[wtfftw]

Urban75 says otherwise.

 

[equationgirl]

Until I get a letter telling me it's dead, it isn't dead. It seems the media would like feminism to be dead so we can go back to the 1950s when women weren't independent and didn't have opinions and behaved like women should (housewives & secretaries).

 

[Treacle Toes]

If I receive such a letter I will of course bin it like I do all junk mail.

 

[Poot]

Until I get a letter telling me it's dead, it isn't dead. It seems the media would like feminism to be dead so we can go back to the 1950s when women weren't independent and didn't have opinions and behaved like women should (housewives & secretaries).

It's not just the media ( although it mostly is), I'm noticing some very archaic attitudes from all over the place of late. It's almost as though a recession gives carte Blanche in some quarters to treat women like second class citizens. This makes the whole concept of feminism even more important than before. I sincerely hope that other women realise this.

 

[IC3D]

we bring together a group of female thinkers

What's a female thinker?

 

[Treacle Toes]

Apparently, women who think, as opposed to those who don't.

 

[_angel_]

Or because there's plenty of nutters in it.

feminism or net mums?

 

[sihhi]

Netmums 'survey' is a vile and sickening media exercise.

'Use a nanny to care for her kids' ... 'respected and supported'.
Kids who've had their mothers work as nannies and cleaners will never respect and support it.

'Be a stay at home mum baking cupcakes' - what kind of nonsense stereotype is this?
23% say it's acceptable to 'marry for money' (husband as lord and master) and 63% say 'topless modelling' (sexualised degradation for money) is acceptable.
69% believe the major task is the reinstatement of the value of motherhood? Er, what?

'We've got the choice to have a career, but most of us have no choice' ... Again what?
And that's the fault of feminism, apparently 'a downside to its success'.

Apparently only 8% of 20-24 year olds regard themselves as feminists, according to Netmums. Any examination of the 20-24 year olds on netmums? No.

feMEnism. ME. The 'survey' is an attempt to attract advertising revenue from advertisers to their website. These are entrepreneur people making choices. Middle-class, anti-woman and anti-feminist.
Its research (sample and questions alike) is bogus and no newspaper should be accepting any of its conclusions or research as a starting off point for anything.

 

[Vintage Paw]

It's not just the media ( although it mostly is), I'm noticing some very archaic attitudes from all over the place of late. It's almost as though a recession gives carte Blanche in some quarters to treat women like second class citizens. This makes the whole concept of feminism even more important than before. I sincerely hope that other women realise this.

Yep. It's not just the recession though. There's a kickback against women/feminism all over the place, particularly in the deepest, darkest recesses of the internet, but of course it's clear as well when you look at the 'war on women' in the US and so on. Part of it, I'm sure, is a last gasp of people who once could count quite squarely on their own power, as they have that certainty stripped away. They're going kicking and screaming. They're on the wrong side of history, and they know it. And they're damn sure they're going to make a hell of a lot of noise and won't go down without a fight.

 

[SlaveofSolitude]

How can it be dead when a woman can display a belly button ring in public and nobody bats an eyelid?

 

[Maurice Picarda]

Until I get a letter telling me it's dead, it isn't dead. It seems the media would like feminism to be dead so we can go back to the 1950s when women weren't independent and didn't have opinions and behaved like women should (housewives & secretaries).

Speaking on behalf of the media, we don't really care about your independence and opinions as long as you can be relied upon to buy stuff. There are certainly some consumer product categories which feminism might threaten, but independence is broadly helpful: it increases the number of people who need to be persuaded into choices.

 

[Poot]

How can it be dead when a woman can display a belly button ring in public and nobody bats an eyelid?

How is that feminism?

 

[Treacle Toes]

How can it be dead when a woman can display a belly button ring in public and nobody bats an eyelid?

Because eyelids have rights too?

 

[Vintage Paw]

The "FeMEnism" thing makes me want to smash a large amount of all the things.

 

[equationgirl]

If mums with daughters have daughters that aren't aware of feminism, then surely the mums at some point haven't explained what feminisim is. Now, it's not just down to the mums admittedly, but for a child to have reached teenage years and be completely devoid of any notion at all about feminism is quite an achievement - no television, radio, internet or reading materials of any kind in order for that to happen. Incredible.

 

[equationgirl]

The "FeMEnism" thing makes me want to smash a large amount of all the things.

With power tools

 

[sihhi]

The "FeMEnism" thing makes me want to smash a large amount of all the things.

"Biggest battle is to reinstate the value of motherhood".
The clue is the 're-', they think the 'value of motherhood' has been lost, but implicitly was once there in sexist, classist Britain of the 19?0s.

 

[SlaveofSolitude]

How is that feminism?

Woman are now free to participate equally in the Great Struggle Against Boredom, thus revealing along the way that their inner-vacuity is on a par with that of any man.

 

[equationgirl]

Woman are now free to participate equally in the Great Struggle Against Boredom, thus revealing along the way that their inner-vacuity is on a par with that of any man.

Inner vacuity? Do you think women are vacuous with nothing of interest to say?

 

[toggle]

I think there's a lot of a younger generation that have completely fallen for the media protrayal of feminism as uppity women demanding to be in charge of men. Young lad in class last week was happily telling me that feminism was a cause of discrimination, gave one example of a woman in a position in an acedemic department as proof that women didn't face a glass celiling in employment, and didn't actually believe paygap existed. This is at the institution that was host to such delights as 'uni lad' whose assertions that men should rape for entertainment because women wouldn't report it, made national news. I was just astounded by how much he had bought into the perception that women asking for equality was wrong and how much some of the younger women in the class went along with it.

 

[SlaveofSolitude]

Inner vacuity? Do you think women are vacuous with nothing of interest to say?

Mostly, yes. Most men too.

 

[_angel_]

"Biggest battle is to reinstate the value of motherhood".
The clue is the 're-', they think the 'value of motherhood' has been lost, but implicitly was once there in sexist, classist Britain of the 19?0s.

I can sort of understand what they're saying. Re: the drive to completely obliterate stay at home parenting completely unless you're very rich.
Once upon a time one wage was enough for a household to live on, now both parties struggle working fulltime... The relentless attacks on single mums/ benefits etc now there is no culture that staying home with kids is actually even a job at all, unless you're being paid to look after someone else's

 

[revol68]

I wish netmums was dead